Genie 4

(deepmind.google)

257 points | by acossta 1 hour ago

44 comments

  • kouteiheika 58 minutes ago
    Looks cool, but it's very hard to get me excited about yet another proprietary model for which absolutely zero technical details are released (not even the number of parameters), which is safetymaxxed to the limit, and whose usage quota will (most likely) be so limited that it'll be effectively useless for anyone who doesn't work at Google or doesn't have infinite money.
    • peri-cl 37 minutes ago
      > "which is safetymaxxed to the limit,"

      I feel refusal'd just *looking* at this page.

    • spiderice 14 minutes ago
      I don't get how Google is so horrible at product. Let me play with this. Otherwise it's DOA.
    • estearum 41 minutes ago
      What an insane set of requirements for a frontier technology and your excitement by it.
      • dack 38 minutes ago
        i think he's bummed out that a cool thing has shipped but: 1. he doesn't get any information about how it works 2. he doesn't get to use it

        sure, it's still a cool accomplishment but i can understand being a little bit frustrated / not as excited for such an announcement.

        • estearum 25 minutes ago
          Most cutting edge technologies through history have been 1) somewhat opaque and 2) narrow/exclusive in their deployment. Historically speaking, that's virtually synonymous with "cutting edge technology".

          Whining that I, a random Internet user with limited budget, usecases that the researchers don't care about, and no connection to the researchers, don't get technical details (??) or access (??) on day one is just profoundly goofy shit.

          Obviously being able to use these things right away would be more exciting. But to be unable to get excited by advancements we can't immediately use is... quite entitled.

          • seanhunter 2 minutes ago
            It’s not an exciting advancement if it’s just the AI equivalent of google wave. It’s totally reasonable to be skeptical of marketing and want to try something for yourself.
          • dotancohen 15 minutes ago
            Most cutting edge technologies through history did not have near-peer widely-deployed open competitors. This technology does.
          • visarga 8 minutes ago
            > is just profoundly goofy shit

            Why not expect it? It's what most model releases do.

      • I-M-S 39 minutes ago
        The future is coming by appointment only.
      • recursive 36 minutes ago
        You must have a very narrow conception of sanity.
      • Der_Einzige 30 minutes ago
        No it’s not insane.
      • alex_sf 39 minutes ago
        I mean this doesn't seem very insane? Basic info about the model, the ability to actually use it. Google in particular is awful about getting access to their models from the UX side: I don't even bother trying them out unless it's via openrouter.
        • lukan 34 minutes ago
          Yeah, I want that too, including the weights and training material. But I am still exited by what one could potentially do with it, by looking at the prompts and generated videos, even if it is cherry picked.
      • echelon 37 minutes ago
        Yawn - another closed world model.

        Only open weights matter.

        We should distill everything else we can into open weights.

        These are exciting for robotics and industrial perhaps, but they have no consumer use case until the lid is blown off and consumers can do whatever they want with them.

        So much societal progress is behind held up because the leading labs want to keep a stranglehold on the tech. Imagine if every PhD or hacker had access to the raw weights.

        • estearum 31 minutes ago
          The general history of new technologies is that they're available for a narrow set of circumstances and then they proliferate. Can't believe that needs to be said on "hackernews"
    • siva7 8 minutes ago
      You're damn right if you think quota for this model will be reached after two seconds. It's for the investors (and friends and xooglers) to make real use of this, not for you pleb.
  • mlmonkey 1 hour ago
    In the clip with a marble bust dropped on a watermelon, at this point https://imgur.com/a/IHLnkUs the bust should've toppled over, if the physics were properly modeled.
    • sobellian 0 minutes ago
      It also failed to properly model the physics of knights riding wyverns into battle.
    • peddling-brink 4 minutes ago
      How often do things in the real world not behave exactly as you expected them to?

      I feeling I get from this is that this could be the mental model for a robot in the real world, continuously corrected by actual events.

      We all have a world model in our heads of what we think is going to happen, we adjust quickly (or not) based on what does. This is pretty incredible stuff.

    • dsissitka 27 minutes ago
      They were demonstrating steering.
    • spwa4 35 minutes ago
      That's the thing about machine learning over time, and the big hole in the whole world model idea. Time and time again we make simulations and train models and we think that loop will work. It never does.

      And why not? Because the first model that can actually learn to handle the simulation not only can do the simulation internally too, but it can do it better than out simulation.

      It's where (ex-)"AI luminaries" go to die. It's a way to make glacial, slow progress in the correct direction while never actually getting anywhere.

      So we get to a point and people keep making complicated simulations of one kind or another ... and then someone (some model) who's never used the simulation, and doesn't need it for model training gets by far the highest score on every benchmark and everyone agrees the simulation was kind of beside the point.

  • daniel31x13 43 minutes ago
    Reminds me of a post[1] by Sam Altman in 2024:

    > movies are going to become video games and video games are going to become something unimaginably better

    Sometimes I really wanna skip 10 years into the future and see where all this eventually leads.

    [1]: https://x.com/sama/status/1776083954786836979

    • sottol 40 minutes ago
      > Sometimes I really wanna skip 10 years into the future and see where all this eventually leads.

      Sounds glib, but honestly ... more Ads :/

    • 0c3ca83 16 minutes ago
      So, people will be able to completely skip living in the real world, and instead spend their entire time plugged into a simulation, like a vegetable.

      Sounds wonderful. May as well skip this and just spend my life hooked up to an IV drip of drugs.

      • siva7 5 minutes ago
        Sounds like the plot from the movie matrix. Only difference between the movie and our real timeline - the ai didn't need to enslave humans, we willingly chose enslavement by ai for ourselves by continuing our google subscription.
    • lifeisloving 5 minutes ago
      Type of thing he would say.

      Llms wont be able to create good games. Consider for a sec that there's like 500 "Great" games ever made, maybe more but not much, in some genres that number is less than 10. There is no training data, and its largely a matter of taste and culture that cant be represented/distilled into vector embeddings.

    • Jtarii 37 minutes ago
      > movies are going to become video games and video games are going to become something unimaginably better

      This is the kind of detached from reality, devoid of humanity statement only a tech bro could come up with.

      • phailhaus 28 minutes ago
        It boggles the mind how these people can be so dumb. He literally does not understand why people enjoy movies.
    • spwa4 29 minutes ago
      Why wait? It's become very clear already: https://kotaku.com/the-proliferation-of-copycats-on-steam-ma...

      Instead of better it's become unimaginably worse since games can no longer serve as a means of self expression because the second you express anything worthwhile 100 people copy it immediately ... without you. It's like Disney (whose whole business model is copying public domain stories and music and ... but taking out the source and everyone who ever had anything to do with it). Except there's no longer one highly selective company destroying the world's culture one piece at a time, but 10000000 idiots looking to make a quick buck, destroying culture and self-expression like a fire raging in the rainforest.

      There will be no more "celeste" games where you join for the platforming but stay for the (politically offensive to all sides) story, because AIs won't discuss the story as it's politically incorrect. Celeste is fundamentally about depression and anxiety, due to being transgender, and is about offending both sides of the argument. First, the main character is transgender, with zero explanation or need for explanation how far that goes, which of course offends conservatives. Second the goal of the main character is to run away from any provided help and professionals (which the director did too) and even under the most extreme of circumstances only reluctantly accept help from a family member that then promptly dies making things "worse".

      The Qwen and other Chinese models (and ...) will refuse to discuss being transgender at all, and any western models will shut down any discussion of running away from help hard (because otherwise they get held responsible for the consequences, as has already happened)

      (oh and that running away from professional help in psychological issue is actually observed to be a positive thing in almost all cases, in studies. The main way to make psychological problems worse is to let them fester and running away from help is time and time again observed to be far more productive than going to professionals and expecting them to fix things. Because that's an extreme human bias: it can never be (allowed to be) the right reaction to NOT do something about a problem, especially when countless people are paid to "solve" the problem. In other words: if you take people who expressed intent to commit suicide and compare the groups who "get help" and the group that successfully shut down help, less people actually go through with it in the second group, and worse than that, the more intense the help, the better the odds the patient ends up killing themselves. Right to the point that doctors sometimes assist such patients because after 2 years of attempts people live in constant misery and have caused enough medical damage that they will have constant pain or worse the rest of their life. And yet people keep forcing help on patients. Usually in response to an actual suicide where no help was provided. Then more help gets built, and 5 years later we yet again observe ... more suicides. But tell someone with an actual problem to avoid help and you'll be skinned alive for that)

      So AI could never make a game like that. Not because it actually can't, or isn't capable, but because there already is a strong political bias, in every model you might use to make it and neither side is going to back down on their policies. The Chinese Communist Party is not suddenly going to change it's mind about transgenderism. And the western models are not suddenly going to openly discuss running away from psychological help, not even as part of a story.

      So really, we've just lost these games.

  • segmondy 36 minutes ago
    With Anthropic going public, I expect a lot of model releases from the competition signalling to the market. "We are still around, please leave some money for us too"
    • lifeisloving 11 minutes ago
      Google is already public, has a larger more normie customer base, many products to integrate AI in with established enterprise accounts in the millions... For some reason theyre not valued at 50:1 revenue... I dont think all that many people are going to be that excited for Anthropic as a business, Its an escape hatch, using the public as exit liquidity while the founders can still make a 100bil.
  • smusamashah 1 hour ago
    A big chunk of the right side of castle disappeared, including catapult, when camera turned back while flying on dragon. See 1:25 to 1:29. I was not expecting this to happen in a "world model".
    • OkayPhysicist 24 minutes ago
      That entire clip looks like it's straight out of a complete bargain-bin videogame. The weird smoothness of the ride, the pivot in mid air, the wings apparently don't have collision with the poles they fly past.

      Definitely wouldn't have been one of my picks to show off my fancy new model.

      • hxugufjfjf 15 minutes ago
        the goal posts have definitely moved since the original will smith spaghetti video huh?
        • OkayPhysicist 9 minutes ago
          Oh yeah, don't get me wrong "bargain-bin videogame" is a wild step up from "accidental amorphous horrors that defy description". It just jumped out to me as looking unusually bad compared to the other samples they provided. The stained glass deer, for example, was awesome.
        • culi 10 minutes ago
          The labs are the ones moving them. We're all just measuring against their own, exponentially growing, claims.
    • ksec 46 minutes ago
      I was under the impression he has already fly past the catapult.
  • gradascent 47 minutes ago
    > Genie 4 is natively multimodal, enabling audio-like music, ambient noises, and interactive dialogue

    What on Earth is audio-like music? Do they mean music-like audio?

    • moritzwarhier 2 minutes ago
      [delayed]
    • thenthenthen 45 minutes ago
      Audio like: music, ambient-noises etc
    • LoganDark 43 minutes ago
      That was probably meant to be an em-dash, or have spaces around the hyphen.
    • vitorfblima 45 minutes ago
      As opposed to video-like music...
    • mailarchis 45 minutes ago
      probably meant "audio like music, ambient noises, and interactive dialogue."
  • germanjoey 45 minutes ago
    In the man walking through the dressing room scene, the camera starts behind the man. And you can see that the left half of his body is wearing a grey suit... but the right half is wearing a grey dress. :O
  • TGower 1 hour ago
    That stained glass landscape video is pretty cool. I wonder if it would be possible to implement that effect in a real-time game engine.
  • runtime_terror 59 minutes ago
    Gotta love the kraken destroying the city in the background of the Hong Kong lovers motorcycle scene despite nothing in the prompt about monsters. Filmmakers are still safe.
    • speerer 52 minutes ago
      It prompts "gigantic alien tentacles that destroy the world."

      I suspect you're reading the base prompt, but the video also demonstrates adding further prompts to change what is happening as the scene progresses.

      • andoando 14 minutes ago
        I thought that was pretty cool.
    • phainopepla2 10 minutes ago
      It was the complete lack of fear or urgency on the part of the characters for me.
  • yipinwong 25 minutes ago
    The prompts build impressive clips.

    I am more interested in how to make consistent "participants" and "environment" with multiple clips so they look like one longer clip.

    Will that require same dev/coding harness and spec-kit-like engineering flow?

    Like create a spec on how a movie will look like, feed contexts, create tasks so that multiple clips look congruent?

  • oldfuture 45 minutes ago
    guys they are building digital cages so they can rob you blind while you are in your nice digital world, sorry we will ignore this stuff into oblivion
  • vatsachak 54 minutes ago
    What is the point of this vs cheap robotic arm simulations?

    The only place I see this applicable is for visual artists prototyping

    • nowittyusername 9 minutes ago
      Humans interact with their environment by subconsciously simulating it and predicting what will happen in the next few moments. This ability gives us the capacity to work more efficiently and reliably in any environment. These world models will serve a similar purpose to the AI and robotic systems of tomorrow. This is a foundational piece.
      • visarga 3 minutes ago
        We don't have to fall off a cliff to learn to drive on a mountain road, we can imagine the consequences for cheaper. If we didn't have imagination life would be much more dangerous.
    • ajs1998 49 minutes ago
      You could produce a thousand cheap ads for your product or one expensive real ad.
      • archerx 11 minutes ago
        Podcasting is going through the thousand cheap ads with the obnoxiously inserted interstitial ads. What they have accomplished is me unsubscribing to the worst offending podcast and beginning the journey of ad blocking on podcast with the help of whisper and LLMs. Also now I hate Shopify with the heat of a 1000 burning suns due to their obnoxious ads and the insane rate they get played.

        So yea that one expensive ad would probably have a positive impact compared to a tidal wave of slop. Quality > Quantity after all.

    • throw310822 47 minutes ago
      You could produce immersive VR content specified only by prompts and in which any action is possible.
      • Jtarii 29 minutes ago
        Wish fulfilment gets extremely boring, extremely fast.

        Video games are interesting because of very specific constraints the developers impose on the player.

        • throw310822 14 minutes ago
          The authors could still design their prompts to steer players towards predefined developments and situations. Anyway, the possibilities of something like this are infinite, the only constraint will be the cost of the compute.
  • zardo 1 hour ago
    Showing off an anglo-bias with the Japanese train station in the 1980s, with a man speaking english.
  • alphabetting 44 minutes ago
    The playable element is cool PR but the news is that endless synthetic training data for embodied AI models is basically here or close.
    • ckocagil 16 minutes ago
      And their most impactful application will be training smaller models for military drones to detect, target and kill humans. sigh...

      Every time I'm about to be excited about AI the cynic in me slaps me back to reality. I imagine the endless possibilities of AI for disabled people, then realize that it's going to leave millions of people disabled instead.

  • WarmWash 46 minutes ago
    I highly suspect that Genie is being made primarily for internal use, and access is more to gather feedback/training data and a bit of PR.
  • BatFastard 1 hour ago
    Amazing!

    Question I have is when will they be able to render something more then 30 seconds.

    And how much will it cost? There has to be a HUGE amount of computing power behind this. As a video game developer I live in fear and anticipation.

  • sodacanner 1 hour ago
    I don't know if I'm missing the point, but Genie 4 almost looks worse than Genie 3 in terms of player control? It doesn't even seem to respond to inputs, it just looks like they took some AI generated videos and put the key widgets on top.
    • maybeOneDay 1 hour ago
      I wonder if that's because the target audience is people directing/producing (commercial) videos, rather than games.
    • doctorpangloss 1 hour ago
      another POV is, what even are these experiences? whom are they for? it would take Google 10 minutes to hire all the best game developers for Android, and cost them like $2m, which is peanuts, and give them fancy Google Research titles. but instead, they're trying to get 100 google PMs, who don't give their kids screentime and who don't play any games the objective of making a product for Bart Simpsons. like these people don't realize that being good parents disqualifies them from making immersive first person shooter, "narrative" experiences.
      • NitpickLawyer 1 hour ago
        > what even are these experiences? whom are they for?

        One possible use for these is to facilitate lab -> this -> real world for robot models. Basically better than lab / algorithmically designed environments and cheaper / easier to train on than real life. Something that "looks" like real life and can scale, to apply RL for robotics to.

        • doctorpangloss 39 minutes ago
          The more parsimonious explanation is that 100 PMs are even less qualified to make surgical robots, but at least they can download a video game and play it for 5 minutes. There's a great scene in You Can See Everything where Billy Evans is watching bio presentations on 1.5x speed, which obviously, makes him look like a huge moron - "knowing enough" bio is very bearish.

          Anyway, let's take your theory to its logical conclusion: the product development between real and simulated soft tissue behavior is much bigger than Exponential Time being a hypothesis and being proven. There isn't some effective acceleraltruist path here. Dario Amodei was a biotech dropout. The thing you are betting on which Google is not doing anyway, maybe they will destroy the descriptive single cell sequencing paper mill, but they're not going to be able to simulate the fat inside a BMI 30 abuela undergoing a gallbladder removal.

          • NitpickLawyer 3 minutes ago
            Sorry, I thought you were asking about the tech applications. I have no idea about the other stuff, can't comment.
      • mlmonkey 1 hour ago
        When Google's epitaph is eventually written, PMs will figure prominently as the catalyst for the rapidly accelerating decline.
      • post-it 1 hour ago
        Just as JPod by Douglas Coupland predicted.
      • paimapi 58 minutes ago
        Why hire crew or actors when you could have them be fully AI? Why film a commercial with fluffed, oil dusted, well-lit hamburgers when you could fully render something? Why actually have a vehicle capable of off-roading when you could just AI-render what it looks like off-roading (or vertically taking off, for eg)?

        It's a dystopian business use case that I hope will get obliterated in the near future as the generations that believe in this stuff and are fascinated by it age out of the population.

      • empath75 1 hour ago
        The point is simulation for autonomous vehicles and robots.
  • HughParry 1 hour ago
    >coming soon to Google AI Ultra subscribers in Project Genie

    Would be fun to muck around with world models. Are there any that I can try for under £200 p/m without being part of a special project?

  • ytxm 1 hour ago
    Surprised that "do you really think we're going to make it?" scene made the cut of the first video, her expression and tone is totally out of sync with the scene and demonstrates the problem with almost every AI gen video I've come across when it comes to capturing humanity.

    The painting->interactive scene looks astonishing though

  • Sol- 1 hour ago
    Neuralink integration and I'm out of here.
  • mike_hearn 55 minutes ago
    Google aren't the only ones with this tech. You can try out a 24/7 rolling set of video feeds for yourself at https://fal.live

    An LLM generates four alternative prompts for what could happen next and there's a real time vote running for each option. It's trippy, like watching someone's dream.

  • reverseblade2 58 minutes ago
    Infinite Tsukuyomi is coming soon…
  • prymitive 45 minutes ago
    The third video is proof that v4 can, ekhm, walk slower?
  • jackb4040 59 minutes ago
    It's hard for me to understand Google's redefinition of "world models" (basically: a txt2videogame modality for LLMs) as anything other than an attempt to bury Yann Lecun's definition of "world models", which includes an implicit bear case against LLMs and thus Google's stock price.
  • wolttam 1 hour ago
    > "A REAL, ultra-photorealistic, high-end 35mm cinematic first-person perspective..."

    Real nice prompting there, Google. It also still looks like a video game rendering.

    • slashtrends 1 hour ago
      ironically, the word "realistic" appears next to game footage, not next to real one.
      • taneq 1 hour ago
        Not ironic at all. You describe a rendered image as photorealistic, you just call a photo a photo.
        • slashtrends 33 minutes ago
          That's the irony. The over prompting ends up doing the opposite thing it is intended to do.
  • ddtaylor 44 minutes ago
    Is anyone actually making any games with these tools? Like, can I play one on Steam or something?
  • delichon 53 minutes ago
    Every increment of advance in this field is an increment of evidence that we are simulations.
    • phailhaus 25 minutes ago
      No it doesn't, not even close. You are looking at a video represented as pixels changing on a flat screen. None of it actually exists. You exist, the computer or phone in front of you is composed of mass and energy, and absolutely none of it is algorithmic. World models, as complex as they are, are still just pushing numbers around on paper.
    • jawns 17 minutes ago
      Even if we can show that it is technically possible to model a universe like ours to the degree that our current perception of reality suggests exists, there are three other big factors that would need to be weighed:

      Is it feasible? What Dyson sphere level of power would be needed to maintain such a simulation? Is that level of energy available to whomever is running the simulation?

      Is there a positive ROI? What does this advanced civilization get out of running such an expensive simulation?

      Is it moral? The simulation involves sentient creatures who are capable of deeply contemplating their own existence, capable of feeling rapturous pleasure and indescribable pain and loss, and ostensibly capable of making moral choices that range from heroic to depraved. Doesn't there come a point where the beings in a simulation are so close to the beings in "base reality" that the same moral principles apply? If you press a button that kicks off a simulation where humans can torture and murder each other, behaving essentially identically to humans in "base reality," aren't you in some sense facilitating those deaths?

      • spiderice 8 minutes ago
        > What Dyson sphere level of power would be needed to maintain such a simulation

        Why would you assume energy is relevant to whoever turned on our simulation? If I created a simulation where the only source of energy was cotton candy, my creations might ask "but where would our creator even get enough cotton candy to run a simulation like this", not realize that it's absurd to think that the creator of a simulation has any of the same constraints that exist inside the simulation.

      • hxugufjfjf 13 minutes ago
        You basically described the plot of World on a Wire.
      • archerx 8 minutes ago
        You run it to see if your military tactics will defeat the enemy and then you keep running it until you find a strategy that guarantees victory. Who cares if some sim lives are churned through the simulation, our lives are at stake!

        Reductionist but I feel like that’s how it would go.

    • recursive 34 minutes ago
      How does that argument work? I've seen more than a few advances, yet I don't see how any of it provides evidence that we are simulations. This might be one of those things that comes down to the definition of "simulation" I guess.
    • dsizzle 43 minutes ago
      Not sure if you're joking, but the only such evidence I could think of would be something like finding some way to influence the hardware of our simulation and seeing a glitch in our world
      • eamsen 30 minutes ago
        [flagged]
  • tempfile 3 minutes ago
    What the fuck are the little wasd/arrow keys supposed to mean? They have no relationship to the movement of the character or the camera. It's just flashing buttons.
  • inshard 1 hour ago
    So world models capture inherent complexity of physical reality to help teach AI about hidden laws which probably helps train both LLMs and multimodal models used for autonomous vehicles and robots? And AMD acquiring World Labs is a move to outdo Nvidia’s work in this space. And Google probably sees this as a gateway to a new platform of autonomous vehicles and humanoids that they could rent out as a CSP? Competing with Nvidia, Tesla and complementing Waymo. Am I getting that right?
  • jeffbee 38 minutes ago
    Prompt: make a press release that isn't a slideshow on this company's own browser and hardware platform.
  • TZubiri 42 minutes ago
    Who'd be down to write a science fiction novel where creating fake images is a crime and not a product?
    • recursive 33 minutes ago
      I guess we'll find out when they publish it.
  • viccis 57 minutes ago
    Hmm, wonder if Databricks trademarked their Genie AI product.
  • artursapek 36 minutes ago
    why does this need to exist?
  • pdntspa 1 hour ago
    So does this export 3d assets or an Unreal/godot/unity project so it can be turne dinto a game or is it limited to their runtime?
  • pacman1337 1 hour ago
    this is the gta6 I am was hoping for
  • varispeed 56 minutes ago
    What is this for? I cannot understand these models. They are very much polluting the internet with nonsense and use capacity that people and businesses need for actual work.

    If these are the cause of why I have to pay 2-4x I used to for a computer, then Google should go fuck themselves.

  • Zambyte 1 hour ago
    From the auto-generated captions on the YouTube video on this page.

    > Genie form [sic] can simulate scenarios

    It's kind of amazing: the juxtaposition of such advanced generative AI and such terrible speech-to-text coming from the same parent company.

    • phoghed 1 hour ago
      The volume of content on YouTube is enormous, I’m kind of surprised they offer auto captions at all given that they have little to no competition in the space.
      • rustyhancock 1 hour ago
        Is it surprising? Indexing for search is the backbone of Google's business model.

        It's why if you search a practical task you will often see results link to specific parts of a video.

      • Zambyte 39 minutes ago
        Ok but like, surely the Deepmind team could sneeze and get flawless captions for this video. Why rely on the default YouTube captions instead of just attaching correct ones? It seems silly.
    • panarky 39 minutes ago
      Typos mean the text came from a human.
    • fwip 1 hour ago
      They're not proof-reading the blog posts either. The second sentence:

      > Genie 4 is natively multimodal, enabling audio-like music, ambient noises, and interactive dialogue to be simultaneously generated with the world.

      (Emphasis mine). Like, yeah, I'd sure hope the music is similar to audio.

      I wonder if this was a de-LLMese pass gone wrong, and the original was "enabling audio -- like music, ambient noises, and interactive dialogue -- to be simultaneously generated with the world.

      • artisin 35 minutes ago
        When you're high on vibes, the line between music and audio-like music tends to blur.
      • kridsdale1 1 hour ago
        These days, unproofread text adds authenticity.
        • fwip 18 minutes ago
          Only when it's a mistake that a human being would plausibly make.
  • Aeveus 1 hour ago
    [dead]
  • rvz 1 hour ago
    As I said before, World models will become simulation engines of AAA games where there is no need to release the actual game artifact and even if the game exists as a binary artifact, it will never be released and will be available on their hosted cloud back-end, then simulated and streamed back to you.

    So, Stadia + World Models = New generation of DRM for games.

    • MattDaEskimo 1 hour ago
      Why? Why would a non-deterministic engine be better for a game when it can be instead structured and made deterministic and then more effectively distributed to consumer hardware?
      • SomeonesAccount 1 hour ago
        It wouldn't be better for players. It would be better for companies because the user no longer owns the computer that runs the game.
        • moralestapia 1 hour ago
          And a month or so of development time. Pure IP re-selling.

          October? Yeah, just release the "Spiderman saves Halloween" prompt.

          This is a wet dream for big studios.

        • phyzix5761 1 hour ago
          You can still stream a deterministic world to the player.
      • verdverm 1 hour ago
        it's not, it just sounds cooler to say prophetic things like this these days
    • causal 1 hour ago
      Game industry is still struggling to find a way to incorporate regular LLMs without suffering catastrophic edge cases. A long way to go before these can do more than fancy tech demo, I think.
    • paxy 1 hour ago
      Because it wasn’t bad enough to need a $5000 5090 to play a game, now you’re going to need a full rack of them!
    • qup 1 hour ago
      They can try, my household won't be purchasing those.

      We'll be riding the huge wave of indie titles that are incoming.

      • verdverm 1 hour ago
        > We'll be riding the huge wave of indie titles that are incoming.

        The problem will be separating the wheat (people with good stories and concepts enabled by Ai) from the chaff (people with no taste slopping out trash with Ai)

        • BatFastard 42 minutes ago
          Isn't that what streamers are for?

          I mean - reviewers!

          • verdverm 18 minutes ago
            streamers and best-in-genre videos have become my primary filter tbh

            been checking out the archives lately, nothing recent excites me

    • ActionHank 1 hour ago
      Because stadia was a real banger right?

      Do you have even the slightest idea of the level of expectation that even the most casual gamer has?

      This isn’t achieving much beyond prototyping. They’re burning so much money for no reason.

    • pixl97 1 hour ago
      And? Just spin up some open world model and pay for the compute and play your own games?

      There are so many options for games now that just sticking with the biggest AAA companies seems like a waste.

    • verdverm 1 hour ago
      Stadia is dead, the reason is playing games over the internet sucks, input lag and serious graphics degradation - this is why I cancelled

      Ai generated games suck even more, no skill; no taste, there is no TLC put into them

      Then there is the economics of it, cost prohibitive to (re)generate a scene and ship that over internet pipes

      • andoando 2 minutes ago
        Geforce Now is still a thing
      • ZiiS 1 hour ago
        Stadia is dead because if you have a data-center of GPUs you are using them for AI. It has nothing to do with input lag and graphics degradation.
        • ActionHank 1 hour ago
          Oh no my guy, you are misremembering, stadia died a quiet death long before AI.

          The latency was no good even on fast internet for even slow games. It is and was pointless.

          • Matl 44 minutes ago
            Stadia was pretty good, be it OnLive was similar quality in like 2010. It even had the best version of Cyberpunk 2077 when that launched. But the model was free version of the service for a limited resolution AND you have to buy games there OR a subscription based option and you still have to buy games there.

            That made no sense and wasn't a viable business model.

        • verdverm 1 hour ago
          stadia died way beforehand, history is useful

          https://www.denofgeek.com/games/why-google-stadia-failed-shu...

          • ZiiS 1 hour ago
            I am sure the are other typical Google fumbles that would have meant they were not the victor; but I am sure an equivalent service would be mainstream today if AI had not dramatically changed the economics. [also Google bought DeepMind in 2014; 'way beforehand' is and odd way to look at it]
            • verdverm 1 hour ago
              I disagree, dropping below 60 FPS will be noticed and turn players away, you are not getting that with good input handling even today, it has nothing to do with GPUs and everything to do with networking

              > beforehand...

              is about the craze, the ChatGPT moment and beyond, when GPUs demand went exponential, not when various types of Ai algorithms were available

              • ZiiS 28 minutes ago
                It is about when Google realized GPUs were about to go exponential; they may have missed some opportunities but they were well ahead of the curve.
                • verdverm 17 minutes ago
                  sure... despite all the other people who used it and are saying otherwise, and the fact that google totally fumbled in the Ai race as well as built custom silicon for Ai...

                  ... history is helpful ... google didn't - and still doesn't - understand gamers, same for all the other Ai hucksters, gamers are among the most anti-Ai

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1Fv1uKTd-w

      • Aeveus 1 hour ago
        [dead]
    • well_ackshually 1 hour ago
      And nobody will play that trash, and the world won't change.

      Also, lmao, they're already trying to nickel and dime you and sell you microtransactions that took 5 minutes to make for 10 bucks. If you think they're going to pay the costs for running a world model for every single person, lol.

  • 233mhz 1 hour ago
    Y tho?
  • ajs1998 52 minutes ago
    Who is asking for this? Do advertisers really want this? I feel dread about many of the AI products being sold. They're mostly tools to help funnel money from the users to the bosses.